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 Post subject: Re: ptb/ptc car counts
PostPosted: Tue Dec 10, 2013 12:39 pm 
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how far off is ST3's ratio for you? Change to the classes out there vs changing the classes to fit you isn't totally unreasonable is it?

TX had points scorers of:
PTB - 1 that ran most races
PTC - 17 (4 tin-tops + 13 Legends cars)
PTD - 7
PTE - 12 (admittedly bolstered by some SM/SSM double-dipping)
PTF - 9

PTB and PTC get pushed over into the SU/ST/GTS run group sometimes instead of the PTD-F/SE30/944S run group, and suffer a little car-count wise for it imo - no fun getting run over by those cars every few laps.

For comparison:
GTS1 - zero cars
GTS2 - 10
Spec Miata - 77
CMC - 31
AI - 25

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Ken Brewer - formerly 1994 Toyota MR2 #6 TTF, PTF, E3
2012 C6Z06
2010 RX8 R3


Last edited by kbrew8991 on Tue Dec 10, 2013 12:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: ptb/ptc car counts
PostPosted: Tue Dec 10, 2013 12:41 pm 
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tx, 1 regular in b, 3 in c, 3 in e, 3 in f. great lakes looks good for e, 1 race with 3 in B

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 Post subject: Re: ptb/ptc car counts
PostPosted: Tue Dec 10, 2013 12:41 pm 
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AZ has a small PTE field right now...I know, I whooped whoever showed up lol...
...BUT at our 2.5hr enduro there were 5 E3 cars (I was weiner!) and there are 3-4 TTE cars making the jump.

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 Post subject: Re: ptb/ptc car counts
PostPosted: Tue Dec 10, 2013 12:42 pm 
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Raw competitor count isn't a number to completely ignore - they're guys/gals with cars ready to go, just need some extra enticement to come out more often. I hear ya that as a regular it feels like regulars is all that matters though.

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Ken Brewer - formerly 1994 Toyota MR2 #6 TTF, PTF, E3
2012 C6Z06
2010 RX8 R3


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 Post subject: Re: ptb/ptc car counts
PostPosted: Tue Dec 10, 2013 12:43 pm 
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I;ve thought about ST3, but the biggest tire I can manage right now is a 245. I'm currently under powered for B, but it's a turbo car so pretty cheap to remedy the power part.

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 Post subject: Re: ptb/ptc car counts
PostPosted: Tue Dec 10, 2013 12:48 pm 
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245s isn't awful, you get a pretty good credit on the ratio for it. If it were me I would try and drop some weight in addition - then you also don't need as much power and get the weight benifit in corners and braking.

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2012 C6Z06
2010 RX8 R3


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 Post subject: Re: ptb/ptc car counts
PostPosted: Tue Dec 10, 2013 1:09 pm 
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kbrew8991 wrote:
245s isn't awful, you get a pretty good credit on the ratio for it. If it were me I would try and drop some weight in addition - then you also don't need as much power and get the weight benifit in corners and braking.


that's another issue. I run bfg R1 for their great contingency (that I rarely get to use) they cost as much points as a 275 hoosier A6. NASA must be in bed with Hoosier is the only thing I can figure. Also my car is 3200 race weight, so tire size could help me. Put my flying brick with a turbo penalty against a n/a C5 with 275s and it gets to be a joke. I hate to sell my car because I love it, but I didn't go to comp school to do time trials.

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 Post subject: Re: ptb/ptc car counts
PostPosted: Tue Dec 10, 2013 1:19 pm 
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ST3 maths
3200lbs min weight - 367 allowed AWHP with the following credits/hits
+0.4 for 4 door sedan
-0.5 for AWD
+0.4 for 275s
That's not bad numbers. Would drop to 347 allowed AWHP if you choose to do aero in ST3 (extra -0.5 hit in the math).

The changes you're looking at going from PTB to ST3 are the same kind of changes *everyone* would be facing if their PT class converts to an ST style class. And those with more pedestrian chassis are going to be more against it lest they start to look at a similar Subaru vs Corvette type battle that you're looking at. Imagine trying to field a Sentra and Miata at the same hp/weight ratio. Which brings me to another plus of the PT system - each platform gets a different starting point to (hopefully) account for its strenghts/weaknesses (if any).

If you want a copy of the ST Excel calculator sheet I built, PM me your email - fun to play what-if's with. :)

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Ken Brewer - formerly 1994 Toyota MR2 #6 TTF, PTF, E3
2012 C6Z06
2010 RX8 R3


Last edited by kbrew8991 on Tue Dec 10, 2013 2:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: ptb/ptc car counts
PostPosted: Tue Dec 10, 2013 1:35 pm 
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nah, I worked it out (slow day at work). ST3 isn't bad and not out of the question, but ST4, say at 10:1 would be ideal. Shredding transmissions gets to be a problem for me at that power level. Thinking about the other guys in PTB that have the same prob as me. If you don't have a turbo car, adding 100hp is expensive.

I looked up points standings for all regions and E is the best (esp in California). D is ok and B&C is pretty much nonexistant (less than 10 nationwide).

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NASA-SE PT Director


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 Post subject: Re: ptb/ptc car counts
PostPosted: Tue Dec 10, 2013 2:00 pm 
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We had a ton of B/A cars a few years ago (and TTC cars). They have all either gone to GTS3 or ST3 (or just left altogether).

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